wake on PDM microphone

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 15:59:35 GMT

[quote user="tldr"]any help in terms of wake sense pin I should use or how to actually use the driver are appreciated. the idea is just to see all the wake features of the device and i'd start with the static threshold they've defined to see it wake. when i do revisit; i can comment here or add it to my sample.[/quote]

I am afraid I don't have enough proficiency on the VM3310 to write up anything that can help you better than the datasheet. I recommend understanding its state machine. It looks like the DOUT signal will trigger automatically when the device is in the right mode, so it shouldn't be difficult to setup.

Regarding the driver in the Edge Impulse application, I don't think it can be used for your need out of the box. You are better off using I2C driver if you ever need to reconfigure the microphone wake threshold.

[quote user="tldr"]the nfc wake requires one scan to wake and another to actually read the tag. if there were a way to get the data at wake and not have to double tap...that would be great.[/quote]

I can't verify this idea right now, but you can setup the application to check RESETREAS if it was reset due to NFC during initialization. If it was woken up by NFC, actively perform an NFC read.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 15:26:07 GMT

I've been busy with other complications; any help in terms of wake sense pin I should use or how to actually use the driver are appreciated. the idea is just to see all the wake features of the device and i'd start with the static threshold they've defined to see it wake. when i do revisit; i can comment here or add it to my sample.

the nfc wake requires one scan to wake and another to actually read the tag. if there were a way to get the data at wake and not have to double tap...that would be great.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Tue, 09 Jul 2024 19:17:26 GMT

[quote user="tldr"]In terms of waking on sound, it looks like theres a way to do it or that its supposed to. I'm still looking at the drivers from edge impluse but I wonder if I even need that for threshold and sense wake.[/quote]

Let's first go back to this. I give the driver and the VM3011 datasheet a quick look. It seems the VM3011's DOUT output is supposed to be used as an alert for the system to start processing further data. The driver in the Edge Impulse repo you found works like that. Therefore, the function to set the threshold is static and isn't accessible from outside.

I am not sure what kind of behavior you want for your device, but it looks certain that it is possible to implement waking up the system from System OFF sleep with the VM3011's DOUT output.

I am a bit uncertain whether you need any particular help with this though.

[quote user="tldr"]Just to be more clear about why I had to add CONFIG_MCUBOOT_SERIAL=n

C:/ncs/v2.7.0/bootloader/mcuboot/boot/zephyr/io.c:48:2: error: #error "Serial recovery selected without an entrance mode set"
48 | #error "Serial recovery selected without an entrance mode set"

was the error you get with just the gpio off.[/quote]

Ah yes, that makes sense. Thanks for revisiting this point.

[quote user="tldr"]

With v2.7.0; I had to use sysbuild\mcuboot.conf and get rid of child_image\mcuboot\mcu_boot.conf

I found this info from https://docs.zephyrproject.org/latest/samples/sysbuild/with_mcuboot/README.html

[/quote]

Thanks for this too. I have not started with sysbuild myself 😅

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Tue, 09 Jul 2024 15:01:01 GMT

Just to be more clear about why I had to add CONFIG_MCUBOOT_SERIAL=n

C:/ncs/v2.7.0/bootloader/mcuboot/boot/zephyr/io.c:48:2: error: #error "Serial recovery selected without an entrance mode set"
48 | #error "Serial recovery selected without an entrance mode set"

was the error you get with just the gpio off.

With v2.7.0; I had to use sysbuild\mcuboot.conf and get rid of child_image\mcuboot\mcu_boot.conf

I found this info from https://docs.zephyrproject.org/latest/samples/sysbuild/with_mcuboot/README.html

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Fri, 05 Jul 2024 11:33:57 GMT

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate the perspective on the DFU.

The drivers I have found are here:
https://github.com/edgeimpulse/firmware-nordic-thingy53/tree/main/drivers/vm3011
vm3011_wos_dout_thresh_set might be something in there.
Thats all the code I can find out there for the pdm microphone.

Thanks for verifying on the color sensor. That's too bad.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Fri, 05 Jul 2024 08:32:31 GMT

[quote user="tldr"]

config BOOT_SERIAL_BOOT_MODE
bool "Check boot mode via retention subsystem"
depends on RETENTION_BOOT_MODE

Looks like this retention method might work?

[/quote]

It might work, but you might want to imagine what you want to do with the Serial Recovery feature.

If the application can run to write to GPREGRET, then it should also be able to receive DFU package.

The benefit of using Serial Recovery then is to reduce application size.

Though I imagine you could also add some login during the initialization phase to check if the device has been functioning properly, and if not (like crashing 5 times in a row?), try to go into bootloader mode. This is just a quick idea though, you will want to think about what makes sense for your product.

I am unfamiliar with the driver in the Edge Impulse sample application. Are you referring to this? nRF Machine Learning (nordicsemi.com).

I haven't found mentions of the microphone in that though.

[quote user="tldr"]I don't know if wake from light is possible? I don't think theres a pin you can sense wake?[/quote]

Do you mean by the BH1749NUC color sensor on the Thingy:53? It doesn't seem so. Its datasheet shows that the only interface it has is I2C.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Wed, 03 Jul 2024 14:37:47 GMT

Jump to bootloader (mcuboot) from application without button

config BOOT_SERIAL_BOOT_MODE
bool "Check boot mode via retention subsystem"
depends on RETENTION_BOOT_MODE

Looks like this retention method might work?

In terms of waking on sound, it looks like theres a way to do it or that its supposed to. I'm still looking at the drivers from edge impluse but I wonder if I even need that for threshold and sense wake.

I don't know if wake from light is possible? I don't think theres a pin you can sense wake?

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Fri, 28 Jun 2024 11:17:17 GMT

[quote user="tldr"]I found it wasn't enough and I had to put
CONFIG_MCUBOOT_SERIAL=n
in as well.[/quote]

OK. That's a little surprising. I guess with GPIO not enabled, Serial Recovery default to a different entrance method, some waiting form, and keep the execution stuck in MCUboot still.

[quote user="tldr"]Correct, a button press entry into DFU mode would not work. Updates were not top of my priority list[/quote]

I think you can use BLE as the primary DFU transport. Serial Recovery is quite nice to have, but not a must.

[quote user="tldr"]the concept I was thinking would be a bluetooth command to write a flash value indicating entry into the serial recovery feature and sys_reboot()? [/quote]

I don't think there is native support for it, but it's a direction. Not sure how comfortable you are with modifying MCUboot though.

Here is the definition of the natively supported entrance methods: https://github.com/nrfconnect/sdk-mcuboot/blob/v2.0.99-ncs1/boot/zephyr/Kconfig.serial_recovery#L133-L187

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Thu, 27 Jun 2024 18:29:21 GMT

No apologies needed. I appreciate that you continued your efforts!

added child_image\mcuboot.conf with
CONFIG_GPIO=n
I found it wasn't enough and I had to put
CONFIG_MCUBOOT_SERIAL=n
in as well.

This fix also worked in the project not just the sample. Cheers and thank u.

Correct, a button press entry into DFU mode would not work. Updates were not top of my priority list, but the concept I was thinking would be a bluetooth command to write a flash value indicating entry into the serial recovery feature and sys_reboot()? With it being compiled out, this is not an option currently.

It's unfortunate that mcuboot causes such a lock and the way in which it locks can corrupt attached i2c device memory.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Tue, 25 Jun 2024 15:27:56 GMT

My apology for the long absence.

I just want to let you know that I am still working on this case.

I have thought that the issue is with the Serial Recovery feature, where MCUboot would enter recovery mode and await a new application image. CONFIG_BOOT_SERIAL_ENTRANCE_GPIO enabled this feature, and it is on by default.

However, further testing show that it might not be the case. The device remains stuck even after I disabled Serial Recovery completely, not just the button entrance method.
(I also ran into the observation that button0 somehow cannot be used instead)

At the moment, I have found that if we disable the GPIO driver completely by setting CONFIG_GPIO=n for MCUboot, then the device works as expect.

However, I don't know if this state is acceptable for you. I know you plan to use MCUboot, but do you plan to use the Serial Recovery feature?

Considering that you want the device to work with the scenario where an end-user would repeatedly press the button, you will not be able to use the button to enter the Serial Recovery mode, regardless of configs.

Please let me know what you think. I have a few more things I will try tomorrow, but I don't have high hope it will bring any difference.

Once again, I am very sorry for the long wait.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Thu, 06 Jun 2024 01:47:34 GMT

Tried setting mcuboot-button0; it looked like it was working for a while but still found myself with a locked up device.

aliases {

mcuboot-button0 = &button0;

};

I haven't found any information on how to get my project working while disabling the mcuboot. I can't use the RTC module when this occurs and switching the device is no fun.

I hope you have success in finding a solution.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 15:27:05 GMT

Thank you for the response and glad to hear you were able to reproduce. Your thoughts that it had to do with mcuboot is correct. I was able to disable the mcuboot via CONFIG_BOOTLOADER_MCUBOOT=n in the sample I provided.

Disable MCUBoot on start-up

I'm not yet educated enough to know how to overlay the mcuboot child image to use a different GPIO. The device no longer locks up. I would like to keep mcuboot for future upgrades so knowing how to resolve this another way aside disabling mcuboot would be nice. This is progress though;

I will try this in my other code and see if this resolves the lockups.
>> I tried in my other project; the code no longer runs at all, no button presses wake the device and reset also doesn't show a lit led as it normally would. disabling mcuboot in my other project is not a general solution it appears.

Thanks again.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Tue, 04 Jun 2024 13:54:43 GMT

Thank you for the patience.

I reproduced your observation. I suspect that the issue lies with MCUboot processing the button but not 100% sure yet.

I will keep working on it and come back to you soon.

In case you want to try, a simple test would be overlaying the MCUboot child image to use a different GPIO as the button instead of where the button really is.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Sun, 26 May 2024 11:54:50 GMT

I decided against the additional commit with the code I attempted to resolve this issue. None of those attempts worked.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Sun, 26 May 2024 02:39:10 GMT

I just tried the tldr_sleep_wake_buzzer sample and spamming the button leads to nonresponsive device. just press the button it turns on lights the light and plays a sound. its not much code.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Sun, 26 May 2024 02:18:53 GMT

ncs\v2.6.1 I provided a sample of code, I've provided a description of the situation.

https://github.com/davehorner/tldr_sleep_wake_buzzer

operates like the system_off nfc sample, it wakes and sleeps, the button wakes and second press buzzes until it turns off, but if pressed many times or randomly, it will not wake. I've tried configuring the gpio from all over. removing call backs. etc.

Using printk isn't really useful when the system gets shut off every 6 seconds.
If I change the gpio from within system_off, i find it doesn't stay off and cycles instead on and off.

---

The device I'm working on wants to be off and sense when the device moves, button press, or nfc tag is detected.

The device becomes non responsive or continually resets itself randomly,

sys_poweroff();

is troublesome.

https://developer.nordicsemi.com/nRF_Connect_SDK/doc/latest/nrf/samples/nfc/system_off/README.html -- void field_sens_start(void) is referenced but not in sample code and its not clear to me where to use it and "When using the registers to wake up the device, replace start_nfc() with the following function:" isn't clear to me.

---

I believe I might need to be using field_sens_start() when using nfc in my case but I do not understand. I have tried many thing in the interrupt and in the thread to disable PWM and other peripherals; in my attempts to unstick this issue I may have caused myself more trouble. I will try to commit some code to demonstrate some of the things I've tried.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Tue, 21 May 2024 08:54:42 GMT

Hi tldr,

My apology for the long wait and thank you for your patience.

Which version of NCS are you using, and how are you shuting down the device?

Could you be experiencing the issue discussed here: CAF button wakeup does sometimes not happen in ncs 2.5.0, if pressed again while powering down?

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Fri, 03 May 2024 14:57:13 GMT

I understand the title of this help is now incorrect.

I think I am experiencing something like:

wake from GPIO using SENSE without a race condition - Nordic Q&A - Nordic DevZone - Nordic DevZone (nordicsemi.com)

which ended with the developer saying it was related to pwm; which I am using.

I can break up the sample into a smaller sample if need.
The device works fine, except if you spam the button while it is shutting down and then it doesn't come back on a button press again without a reboot. Worse still, it clears the i2c RTC time and ram when it happens.

I have tried adding the code which turns off the PWM before shutdown.

I can create another ticket that is more specifically named; but it would be named the same as the above ticket. There's something wrong with the shutdown when the button is spamed. I have added code that doesn't shut the device down when the button is HIGH; It's like if the button is transitioning, the shutdown fails and the device becomes unresponsive.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Sat, 27 Apr 2024 10:37:15 GMT

yes, there is dead code from the samples mixed together. This board can go into low power mode and wake up based on sensors, but there are no samples of this sort. ticket can be closed.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 13:25:08 GMT

Hi tldr,

Just double checking, but this piece of code after the return 0; on line 321 is intentionally unreachable, right?

tldr_sleep_wake_buzzer/src/main.c at 97ebb248d401d4c17746fcbdaaca67e5e1b0d844 · davehorner/tldr_sleep_wake_buzzer (github.com)

Otherwise, nothing seems outstandingly wrong to me. I could only recommend starting with a relatively blank slate and go over small cycles of adding functionalities and testing, until you can pinpoint at which point it breaks. Does this sound like a reasonable plan to you?

Hieu

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Hieu — Fri, 12 Apr 2024 13:08:57 GMT

Hi tldr,

I will take over from Susheel. I will take a look at the project you link, go over possible options, and get back to you soon.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Fri, 12 Apr 2024 04:36:21 GMT

here's the code I'm working from.
https://github.com/davehorner/tldr_sleep_wake_buzzer

Using printk isn't really useful when the system gets shut off every 6 seconds.
If I change the gpio from within system_off, i find it doesn't stay off and cycles instead on and off.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

tldr — Thu, 11 Apr 2024 14:03:09 GMT

Thank you for your response! The primary purpose of this question is about using the microphone and trying to wake via a threshold.

I was describing my code to give a sense of where I was coming from. I am looking for help in waking from PDM. I do appreciate the information you provided.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

Susheel Nuguru — Thu, 11 Apr 2024 10:52:22 GMT

The button callback will not be called when it is waking the chip from system off as the chip will be reset in this situation. If you were doing a system on idle sleep (WFE/WFI) and then try to wakeup from that, then your button callback handler will be called as you expected.

So, in short, you need to implement your button callback handler after detecting that the wakeup (reset) reason is caused by the GPIO from system off

You need to look into POWER-RESETREAS register to see if this wakeup is caused by a GPIO and then (BITMASK F -> OFF = set) and then call your button handler manually if this bit is set. I am assuming that there are no other wakeup sources from systemoff apart from this, so no need to check the GPIO registers to validate that it was a button that caused the wakeup.

RE: wake on PDM microphone

generallysilver — Thu, 11 Apr 2024 02:41:25 GMT

i noticed there are a few errors in your system_off nfc sample, to wake up the board on button press on audible wake need to properly reference their metrics in the system_off sample. Make sure to connect them correctly for operation.

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