NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Wed, 20 Nov 2024 09:16:24 GMT

Achim Kraus that is very good news! Thanks for the update!

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Wed, 20 Nov 2024 08:52:42 GMT

Just if someone reads it, the issue of mfw 2.0.1 with 26202 LTE-M (Rel 14) is fixed with mfw 2.0.2

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Wed, 03 Jul 2024 10:07:21 GMT

Thanks! That is good information to be aware of 👍

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Wed, 03 Jul 2024 06:14:22 GMT

The upload issue was caused by Ubuntu 22.04 and Firefox from snap. That blocks files in the ".config" folder and sub-folder. Moving the file to the home makes it possible to upload it.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Tue, 02 Jul 2024 15:50:37 GMT

devzone.nordicsemi.com/.../trace_2D00_2024_2D00_06_2D00_30T14_2D00_24_2D00_14.950Z.mtrace

Maybe uploading a trace with windows works.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Tue, 02 Jul 2024 15:41:25 GMT

[quote userid="77062" url="~/f/nordic-q-a/112463/nas-rai-non-access-stratum-rai-used-on-nb-iot-with-nrf9161-51/491899"]If there is an issue with mfw 2.0.1, then it would be very good with modem traces. [/quote]

It looks like.

I tried to send the modem trace via a "message". Not sure, if that works. Looks like the same function and issue as for tickets.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Tue, 02 Jul 2024 15:21:00 GMT

[quote user="AchimKraus"]Strange, seems not to work from my side.[/quote]

Sorry to hear that. If you want you can try to send the file to me directly in a PM to see if that helps. But I understand if you are not able to spend a lot of time on this issue, but it would be good to verify RAI support in your network.

[quote user="AchimKraus"]Testing with a nRF9161-DK v0.9.1, nRF9161 LACA ADA, mfw_nrf91x1_2.0.0 and 26202 LTE-M works. Maybe the 2.0.1 has an issue. I'm still not able to upload modem traces.[/quote]

If there is an issue with mfw 2.0.1, then it would be very good with modem traces.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Tue, 02 Jul 2024 07:31:04 GMT

Testing with a nRF9161-DK v0.9.1, nRF9161 LACA ADA, mfw_nrf91x1_2.0.0 and 26202 LTE-M works. Maybe the 2.0.1 has an issue. I'm still not able to upload modem traces.

The results with 1.3.6 and 2.0.0:

RAi option	AS-RAI	AS-RAI using CP-RAI implicit (fallback)
RAI_SO_LAST	works	works
RAI_SO_ONE_RESP	doesn't work	works
RAI_SO_NO_DATA	works	works

Seems, that "NO_DATA" (now) works also for CP-RAI.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Mon, 01 Jul 2024 09:08:16 GMT

I'm not really able to spend that much time in it, at least not for now.

The nRF9161 and mfw 2.0.1 is not currently the focus of my interest.

" Insert --> Image/Video/File"

devzone.nordicsemi.com/.../trace-2024-06-30T14-24-14.950Z.mtrace

Strange, seems not to work from my side.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Mon, 01 Jul 2024 07:01:56 GMT

[quote user="AchimKraus"]That combination is not able to register at 26202 using LTE-M (the only Rel 14 network here in south germany).[/quote]

That's interesting. Could you please register a new DevZone ticket and provide the steps that you used, i.e. what app, what SIM?

[quote user="AchimKraus"]Not sure, seems, that is not longer possible to drag&drop a modem mtrace[/quote]

I've seen this issue before. Will report to our admin right away, as this should not be an issue. What happens if you choose Insert --> Image/Video/File and manually insert it?

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Sun, 30 Jun 2024 14:48:41 GMT

I've tried to test with a nRF9161-DK v0.9.1, nRF9161 LACA ADA, mfw_nrf91x1_2.0.1.

That combination is not able to register at 26202 using LTE-M (the only Rel 14 network here in south germany).

+CEREG: 2,"B982","031D7801",7
I 02.836 : LTE cell changed: n.a
I 02.836 : LTE Mode: none
+CEREG: 2

Using the same SIM card, a nRF9160-DK, v1.1.0, nRF9160 SICA B1A, mfw_nrf9160_1.3.5, that combination registers in that network.

+CEREG: 5,"B982","031D7801",7,,,"00000000","00111001"

So I'm only able to test the behavior with Rel 13. CP-RAI.

(Not sure, seems, that is not longer possible to drag&drop a modem mtrace. My browser shows "An error occurred. Please try again or contact your administrator". I tried it a couple of times and I consider, it's an issues on Nordic's side.)

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Thu, 27 Jun 2024 12:29:25 GMT

Yes, I have a nRF9161-DK.

Unfortunately, with the decision of Nordic, not to provide the explicit info to the application, what according RAI is supported by network (e.g. which RAI socket option gets active and which is silently ignored) it's not too easy to test it. Currently I'm too short of time, so for now I have to postpone these tests.

(I'm also not aware, that Nordic has consolidated the documentation about RAI (and the pitfalls using it). In my opinion, quite a lot of users here in the forum fail to use RAI successful. Therefore I put the old table in my comment. In the old version "NO_DATA" wasn't enough, because CP-RAI would have silently ignored it.)

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Thu, 27 Jun 2024 11:58:48 GMT

Achim Kraus have you been able to get your hands on a newer nRF9161 to test mfw 2.0.1?

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Thu, 27 Jun 2024 11:57:36 GMT

[quote user=""]What is the equivalent AT command(s) on nRF9161/51 ?[/quote]

Using %RAI is enough. Modem will then, depending on active system and NW support, use either AS-RAI, CP-RAI (referred as NAS-RAI) or both of them when possible.

%RAI contains internal improvements compared to %XRAI.

[quote user="AchimKraus"]Not sure, if Please consolidate nRF9160 documentation about CP-RAI and AS-RAI is valid for mfw-2.0.1.[/quote]

Yes, RAI functionality counts on the fact that application always configures socket option “NO_DATA” after all data has been sent (possibly with the RAI socket option) and a response from server containing user data (i.e. delivered via socket) is not expected.

But RAI depends also on network support and the protocols used, starting from TCP or UDP and everything above that.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Achim Kraus — Wed, 26 Jun 2024 13:34:34 GMT

Not sure, if Please consolidate nRF9160 documentation about CP-RAI and AS-RAI is valid for mfw-2.0.1.

If so, the below table may help to migrate the CP-RAI (NAS-RAI?) options to AS-RAI.

RAi option	AS-RAI	AS-RAI using CP-RAI implicit (fallback)
RAI_SO_LAST	works	works
RAI_SO_ONE_RESP	doesn't work	works
RAI_SO_NO_DATA	works	doesn't work

Especially in the case of CP-RAI/ONE_RESPONSE you need both, "ONE_RESPONSE" (before sending the message) and "NO_DATA" (after receiving the response), otherwise it would fail either with CP-RAI or AS-RAI. And you may need to check the times between the last sent/received message and RRC Idle to see, if it works as intended.

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Wed, 26 Jun 2024 07:26:49 GMT

I see now that the release notes state:

Removed support of AT%XRAI AT command functionality. Release Assistance Indication (RAI) feature for LTE-M and NB-IoT can be used with AT%RAI AT command and socket option interface.

But will ask internally for more information, if any.

Kind regards,
Øyvind

RE: NAS-RAI (Non-Access Stratum RAI) used on NB-IoT with nRF9161/51

Øyvind — Wed, 26 Jun 2024 07:17:51 GMT

Hello François.

I'm not able to find any information on this in the current nRF91x1 Cellular AT Commands document. I could only find information on Release assistance indication %RAI as I assume you have as well.

Edti: The supported AT commands are set in the modem FW i.e. nRF91x1 SiP LTE firmware. See release notes on current version 2.0.1 here.

Will need to ask internally. I hope to have an answer by end of tomorrow.

Kind regards,
Øyvind